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  1. #541
    You might have gotten this question in the past but one of the things I struggle with is whether something is really a good find using sniper. For example sometimes people will post items for extreme prices and then buy them on alts to make the market price avg seem high and their new sell price makes it look like a bargain. How do you avoid things items like that? I feel like I've fallen for this trick a couple of times. Are their certain rule of thumbs you have to help prevent getting swindled? Thanks again for this I've already made some profits off of it. :-)

  2. #542
    Sterling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kennek View Post
    You might have gotten this question in the past but one of the things I struggle with is whether something is really a good find using sniper. For example sometimes people will post items for extreme prices and then buy them on alts to make the market price avg seem high and their new sell price makes it look like a bargain. How do you avoid things items like that? I feel like I've fallen for this trick a couple of times. Are their certain rule of thumbs you have to help prevent getting swindled? Thanks again for this I've already made some profits off of it. :-)
    Hi Kennek,

    With the proper setup, this should never happen. Once you narrow down your sniper list (which takes tremendous effort of course), you'll be protected against most poisoned markets (say, ).

    From that point on, it's a matter of using proper operations to ensure all items you're sniping are being compared to DBMarket, global and regional pricing as required. Anything in high volume (Herbs, ores, silk, etc) can be sniped using DBMarket. Anything that is somewhat rare needs to be sniped with regional or global data.

    Hope that makes sense.

    PS: It's pretty hard to trick TSM.
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  3. #543
    judy's Avatar
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    Tricking TSM is kinda the job of someone making gold with market manipulation, abuse of gold-making tactics/farms

    Ya better put sulfuron hammer in the appearance group as it is one of my greatest gold-making favorites

    Thanks sterling for the Rare group in the appearance group, hope it is complete .

    Found an for 1365g which is a drop from griegen, one of the extremely rare northern creatures. Posted it for 59999g 99s
    Another item was which is dropped from a 2 hour spawn mob in ghostlands, with a 30% drop chance. No one will take the effort to farm nor post this item. Bought for 34g, now posted for 14999g 99s
    Last edited by Sterling; November 16th, 2016 at 08:21 PM.
    New banker unusual market manipulation started 18/11/2016 https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/.../seller/edmand
    Check dymseldame on Theunderminejournal EU - Moonglade https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/...ler/dymseldame

  4. #544
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    @judy I think you miss judge the value of items, not only from this last post but from other threads/answers of yours.

    is not worth 60k gold. It's a rather normal and common looking transmog item, although unique on the tab, and it's not even a twink item. On top of that both TUJ and Wowuction rate it at most 2.000g (and that's only TUJ, Wowuction says it's not even 1.000g) throughout all of Europe. There's no real facts or reason to post it at that price, because the selling expectancy is near null.

    The same goes for . It used to be a twink item, for level 19 twinks. It is no longer the case. And both TUJ and TSM rate it at 60g throughout all of Europe. And again it's a very common looking, not so special transmog item, although once more unique in the tab. But the same logic applies, there's no real reasoning behind posting it at 15.000g expecting it to sell.

    I'm not saying that they were bad snipes, even though it's certainly not something I'd invest in. Just that you need to learn how to manage your price expectancy. Probably no one would pay those prices for any of those items, especially in low/medium pop realms, when they can just as well pay the same amount for better looking, unique, or twink alternatives.
    Profession Kits - An Adventure to Millions
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  5. #545
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    @tedj You are correct that they will not sell quickly on my server. I have a max epires of 30 on these items to then post the item for a lower price category.

    The thing in which you are making a big fault is saying that the item is not worth that value because of it's TUJ EU price and the TSM price for the item.
    You have to take into account that the items are extremely rare, especially . The way EU prices have worked out for these items is very simple. A person loots the item and doesn't know it's value - He posts the item for a normal cheap transmog price like 60g which was reasonable 2-3 years ago. A second person finds the item and looks it up on wowhead and sees wowhead saying it's worth 60g and posts his for 90g because he thinks it is more rare.

    It all comes down to one point, everyone is following the same abbsurd price due to it's rarity. I know I post them for too high, I know they will not sell fast. But realy, there are alot of items which are wrongly priced by the community and as they cost very low I will have a big load of these in some time and stuff will start selling at my (absurd) prices. Also found a for 999g, posted it for 199999g 99s . I try to move away from the price programs generate and look at other things like chance of finding the item, avg posted on EU, look of the item. You gotta get to know the price better than the wow community does which is mostly made of people that just post their item to get it quickly sold and don't do research before.
    New banker unusual market manipulation started 18/11/2016 https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/.../seller/edmand
    Check dymseldame on Theunderminejournal EU - Moonglade https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/...ler/dymseldame

  6. #546
    judy's Avatar
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    I know this isn't realy a method to do on a low pop realm and I have made a bank char on ragnaros to get started there. I just buy these items because I am a believer and they just cost very low which doesn't make it a risk
    New banker unusual market manipulation started 18/11/2016 https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/.../seller/edmand
    Check dymseldame on Theunderminejournal EU - Moonglade https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/...ler/dymseldame

  7. #547
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    @judy yes you are partially right. The part where you're right is where you state that you need to do a little bit of research. But as you've read in my previous answer, I too did that.

    In order to properly evaluate an item like these, you need to account for a couple of things. Some of these are facts, some are personal opinions. These may be, but are not limited to:
    • (fact) Availability - How hard it is to get it, either by a drop chance, or rare spawn, etc
    • (fact) Uniqueness - If it's unique in the appearances tab
    • (fact) Demand - How many people are actually after this and how much they are actually paying for it
    • (opinion) Looks - If you think it's something that looks good and players will want to buy for its looks
    • (opinion) Twink - If the item may be used for a twink
    • (opinion) Comparison - Compare the prices of equivalent stuff to it and take out your own price


    The above facts are points that you can't argue with, like the demand. There may be more reasons, but it's morning here and I just woke up.
    Now let's, under these reasons, see your latest purchase :
    • Availability - Ultra rare, dropped by a couple of mobs in MoP's Jade Forest
    • Uniqueness - It is indeed a unique dagger
    • Demand - Throughout Europe there's a 5% demand, which is not bad
    • Looks - As far as I go, and I'm a Rogue, it looks pretty cool and unique
    • Twink - It used to be a twink item from Wowhead comments, but I'm not sure anymore
    • Comparison - Explained in the next paragraph


    Given these, it's clear to me that this item might just be worth a hell of a lot more than the 2.000g listed by wowuction. People might even be willing to pay 20.000g for it or even double of that. But 199.999g? For that same price, they can get 2x , which is far rarer and has a much more unique and amazing look. For that price you can almost get a , which is no longer obtainable and has it's own unique appearance hidden in the tab.

    So when it comes down to claiming a price on your item, yes, do your research, but in the end don't overestimate the value of items, or you might end up not selling them at all.

    Edit:
    Mind you that, for example, Wowuction's demand doesn't show you just the percentage of selling an item, but much more than that. It tells you that at the average price listed there, only a certain percentage of players was willing to buy that item. So if an item has 2.000g EU average buyout, and a 5% average selling, it means that it only has a 5% chance to sell at 2.000g. And usually, if you reduce that price value, the percentage would increase. But if you increase the price, the percentage gets lower.

    So an item that has a 5% chance to sell at 2.000g, would have a next to null chance to sell at 100x times that value (your 200.000g).
    Last edited by tedj; November 18th, 2016 at 05:57 AM.
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  8. #548
    tedj's Avatar
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    Posting in a different reply because it's a bit unrelated to the other one and I want to keep them separate answers, being that this one is more related to snipping and reselling, so some might take this information to learn a bit about what to snipe and post.

    @judy I went through your dymseldame list in TUJ. I've found many other examples where you should review your price expectancy. I've only checked the weapons, because you've got a hell of a big list there (congrats!), but here goes:
    • - You've listed for 30.000g. It has an average price of 250g with 2% demand. While it has a rather unique look, it's not a very appealing one for the current expansion (but that's part of the personal opinion I've listed in the previous post). Drops from AQ'20, which many players are running and for that reason there are 245 listed in all of EU. That means there's an average of about 1 posted per realm, at 250g, and still only a 2% demand.
      • Most definitely not worth 30.000g
    • - Discussed in the previous post
      • Very likely not worth 15.000g
    • - You've listed for 30.000g. It has an average price of 500g with 4% demand. Has a bit of a unique look. Drops from WoD which most people are not running anymore with a low drop rate. There's 20 listed in EU. 30.000g is the price of 2x , an item that sheaths on the back and appeals to many classes although yes, crafted.
      • Not worth 30.000g, maybe 5.000g, a couple thousand more at most
    • - You've listed for 60.000g. It has an average price of 700g, with 4% demand. It looks rather normal, common, unappealing and doesn't have any unique features. Drops from a lot of places in Vanilla content including dungeons, however with a low drop rate and there's 63 listed in EU. 60.000g is almost the price of .
      • Not worth anywhere near 60.000g
    • - Discussed in the previous post.
      • Maybe worth about 20/30.000g at the very most, not worth anywhere near 200.000g


    This review was only for the high posted items. I've noticed however you had many items that were posted under their average price, just because in your realm there was already 1 or 2 posted at a lower price. You've posted Tremendous Tankard O'Terror (level 85 version) for half of its value only because 2 other people have posted it below it. It makes me think that you've also not set a minimum price for your items, and you'd rather post everything at whatever price and sell something just undercutting the competition rather than holding on to your stock. That's not how you should approach snipping and reselling.

    This isn't the only example. You've also got:

    If I was in your realm, I'd actually be snipping you.
    Last edited by tedj; November 18th, 2016 at 05:58 AM.
    Profession Kits - An Adventure to Millions
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  9. #549
    judy's Avatar
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    @tedj I am quite impressed by the length and research done on your post, congrats. Nice layout.
    You are right in comparing it to other items for same price. As I personally think only people that realy need an item because they already have a seriously big collection would pay that much for the items. I overestimated the items and teebu made me realise that.

    Now to the underpriced stuff, I actually don't snipe. And I am just interested in the groups provided by sterling. I did buy too many cheap stuff with shopping scans and I just want to liquidate it. I bought that stuff for bargain
    New banker unusual market manipulation started 18/11/2016 https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/.../seller/edmand
    Check dymseldame on Theunderminejournal EU - Moonglade https://theunderminejournal.com/#eu/...ler/dymseldame

  10. #550
    tedj's Avatar
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    @judy thanks, but after years of doing it, it's really trivial and fast work, plus I only checked your weapons. You can apply the same logic to all of your items now and go ahead and re-price some and you might actually sell more.
    As a personal note: I'm glad I managed to help you understand and that you accepted it.

    As for under priced items, I see your point. However since time is money for us, unless you want to liquidate for bag space/delete char/leave a realm, you should still want to liquidate at an average price, or otherwise just keep them in your bags/banks/guild banks. That is because even if you got some of them as a bargain of say, 5% , you're only selling at 10% of its price (like the Blanchard's Stout). That's barely any profit really. Unless you're liquidating seriously for the reasons I've said before (and if you are, feel free to continue), you should just save these items for later.
    Profession Kits - An Adventure to Millions
    Help and be helped, and we'll have a community.

 

 

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