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  1. #1
    Szar's Avatar
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    How would you deal with this?

    Hi, Long time lurker, first time poster.

    I've tried buying the guy out, and he posts more. I have no clue other then to just stay out of the market.



    If you can't see it, its 65 stacks on a 48 hour auction. He effectively kills the market on half of the gems for 2 days at a time. Usually posting more as soon as he sells out.
    Last edited by Szar; May 13th, 2011 at 12:06 AM.

  2. #2
    Keep buying if 50g is a good price, you'll be able to flip them later, or if he runs out. If you don't have the money, you can either undercut (only if you really need gold), or wait him out.

  3. #3
    Szar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pheonix View Post
    Keep buying if 50g is a good price, you'll be able to flip them later, or if he runs out. If you don't have the money, you can either undercut (only if you really need gold), or wait him out.
    Yeah, thats what i keep doing, buying him out and getting auctions in while he's offline. Right now I have 200 bold, brilliant, and delicates that I've bought from him, I'm just worried I'll be stuck with them for awhile. I suppose I'll keep doing it and eventually he'll run out of rubies, I offered him 40g a piece for all his inferno rubies but he ignored it.

  4. #4
    Aeg's Avatar
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    I dont know your server specifics but on my old server if you were buying my gems at 50g in bulk to keep prices high I would be throwing you hundreds and you would give up before I ran out thats for sure. What elementium ore/obsidium/carnellian prices are you seeing. Is he turning a profit at that point? how much per gem? how many do you sell a day without this guy around?
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  5. #5
    Szar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeg View Post
    I dont know your server specifics but on my old server if you were buying my gems at 50g in bulk to keep prices high I would be throwing you hundreds and you would give up before I ran out thats for sure. What elementium ore/obsidium/carnellian prices are you seeing. Is he turning a profit at that point? how much per gem? how many do you sell a day without this guy around?
    I can usually sell 40-50 of each major inferno ruby cut without him around a day. Usually between 90-120g. Elementium and Obsidium are pretty low, 23g for both and I try to check the AH several times a day and buy up everything just to keep my competitors out of the market. This guy came out of nowhere though so I'm thinking he had a major stockpile before he decided to jump in, server transfered with a bunch of cheap rubies, or has a bot or two supporting him. I have a good relationship with couple ore dumpers on my server so I have plenty of stock, everything i would sell would still be profit even at 50g.

    I'm wondering if I can beat him at his own game. He's posting at 48 hours so his deposits would hurt if he didn't sell any. I may just keep undercutting just to frustrate him and keep offering to buy out his stock.

  6. #6
    Thanateros's Avatar
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    If ppl are posting their auctions for 48 hours in THIS big range, then you can easily frustrate them. As you said - one single auction is mostly enough. Some of them cancel their auctions and repost them again. I have such a case on my server atm with DMF-Trinkets. A guy posts 6 Hurricane(Agility)-trinkets at once for 24 hours. I keep posting a single one for 12 hours only, since i know that i'll have to cancle - repost it at least some times. So he continues the cancel-repost-cycle with 6 trinkets for 24 hours (around 7g fee for all of them every cycle), whilst i only got 50s every cycle. Sure - 7g are nothing compared to the big pool of gold, but hey - it's the thought and the work that counts. And the frustration, since i know exactly that he has AT LEAST 6 of those items he has to get rid off, whilst on the other hand he doesn't know if i got one, two or a dozen of those trinkets.

    In your case, you know that he has at least 65 of those gems. 65 x 48-hour-fee(2.25g) = 146.25g fee for every cycle. Sure - 146g every second day is almost nothing, but compared to the fact that he would have to sell at least 3 of the gems just to get the fee back for the other gems is pretty... heavy. So if you still make some profit, i'd keep posting my gems under his price. Just for the fun to know that he's ruining himself. And if that game goes on a bit, he maybe gets all stressed out and tries to get rid of the gems whatever it costs, so that's where you would step in again to buy his gems ;-)

  7. #7
    Kathroman's Avatar
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    Don't buy him out - as Aeg said, he will probably have pretty big stockpiles, especially if you have tried it before. The best option is probably going to be to go below him and see what his reaction would be. I would probably think he is assuming you all will leave instead of pushing the price down even further. I just wrote a rather long post in the Deep Undecutting thread that cover the other side of this, but I would think he probably figures he can post a huge number of auctions at either a price he is comfortable with or his bottom price. See how far down he is willing to go. Selling all of his gems might be a good idea for him if he can sell them, but if he gets undercut and can't sell them, strategy is broken, isn't it?

    I would want to bait him with at least a few gems to test his resolve a bit.
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  8. #8
    Mugsley's Avatar
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    Back around February, there was a fairly major player in the cut rare gem markets who got frustrated about being undercut. So he decided to tank the gem markets. He would regularly do 10g undercuts, and undercut himself at multiple points throughout the day. I attempted to reset the market on a few cuts, then decided to give up. Instead I followed him down because I was still making profit; but I still only undercut by my standard 1s.

    About a month ago, he stopped posting. And hasn't been back since. So either he's got his gold and has moved on, or he was farming his own ore and is out of stock, or can't be bothered to try to control what has become a very active and volatile market. For whatever reason, he's now out of the way. We still have the occasional established player try to tank the markets, but it never amounts to much success mostly because the other established players just follow that person down with undercuts, then reset when stock runs low. Keep in mind, the cut ruby market on my server never went above 70g for each of the three major cuts until this past weekend, so the competition can be fierce.

    It ultimately comes down to two things: 1) are you still making profit? 2) are you patient enough and positioned well enough in other markets to wait this person out?

    Finally, if this person doesn't leave the market, can you remain in the market and still be profitable to your satisfaction?
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Szar View Post
    Yeah, thats what i keep doing, buying him out and getting auctions in while he's offline. Right now I have 200 bold, brilliant, and delicates that I've bought from him, I'm just worried I'll be stuck with them for awhile. I suppose I'll keep doing it and eventually he'll run out of rubies, I offered him 40g a piece for all his inferno rubies but he ignored it.
    If your worried about being stuck with those gems for a while, have you worked out how many you have bought from him and how many you have resold and thus if you have made a profit?
    As long as you have broken even what ever gems you have left are profit, even if you go to the extreme of vendoring them.
    That does ignore the question of it that profit is worth it but only you can answer that question.

  10. #10
    Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mugsley View Post
    It ultimately comes down to two things: 1) are you still making profit? 2) are you patient enough and positioned well enough in other markets to wait this person out?

    Finally, if this person doesn't leave the market, can you remain in the market and still be profitable to your satisfaction?
    This. A million times this. Obviously this dude has a ton of stock, and he wants to move it. The problem with buying him out at nice profit margins over ore is he'll simply get more and make more. Without knowing how much stock he has or how much ore he goes through in a day, buying him out can be somewhat risky. Of course, you can hit "buy" much faster than he can get through ore, so eventually you can deplete his stock, but the other problem is storage, and reselling everything. If he can get more faster than you can sell it off, then you're in trouble.

    Though like Fluffy said, if you have already recouped your losses, then you've very little to worry about. You're definitely doing the right thing by not just sitting idly by. Right now though, you're options are pretty much undercut, or attempt to buy him out. I'd opt for undercutting, seeing how low you can get him, and then buying him out.
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