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  1. #1

    Smile Auction House Questions - Jewelcrafting Market etc.

    Hey everyone, I'm a new member here but have been reading the forums for about 2 months.

    I'm a new Auction House user cornering the Jewelcrafting Market (and recently attempting to go further in Ench and Inscrip). I have a couple of newbie questions for you all and would appreciate any feedback!
    I currently run Auctioneer as my main addon and I love it. Recently transferred back to my original server, and I found my auctions didn't sell as fast as it did on the other server - theres more activity later on in the evening than the day.
    I have 3 nearly maxed Alchemists, an Inscriptor, Enchanter, and 2 Jewelcrafters with nearly every cut combined.
    Also, the JC market on the server has maybe 4 of us that are constantly posting gems, so I find it competitive to keep up.

    1. I am undercut by a couple of copper within the hour or two I post a gem - I post three at a time now - should I continue to cancel and repost the gems as often as I am undercut? Is that even worth the deposit?
    2. I buy as much ore at 80% or lower of the price Autioneer tells me it's at. Can you never have enough cheap ore or herbs?
    3. The scrolls do not sell for the worth of the mats, should I simply stockpile or sell the mats raw?
    4. I have an Inscriptor(?)/Inscriptionist(?) but do not take advantage of the glyph market as there are so many glyphs that I find it hard to keep up. Should I attempt to tackle the glyph market again?
    5. Out of curiosity, as I have 3 (yes 3) nearly maxxed out alchemists, are there any transmutes I should be doing every day that are vital? I do the Volatile Life xmute every day at the moment. Are blue gems worth it?

    Thankyou for your time and, again, I appreciate any feedback.

  2. #2
    Vanditor's Avatar
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    Although I am not an expert in ore/jc or herb, but I can try to give some answers to your questions:

    1. I do not suggest cancel and repost for gems, espcially if you have just been cut by a few copper. 48h deposit fee for gems is normally 1-2g, so not really worth it. I don't think there is a real solution to your problem, you can either be the last to post (it should be easy if there is only 4 or you) or try to reach an agreement between you (not recommended, cartel never works in real life, even less so here). Otherwise you will just have to wait and hope there is enough people to buy.

    2. As long as you are using cheap herb/ores for shuffling then the answer is clearly no. One word of advice though, do not always trust auctioneer, it is a program and like any other program it can be fooled by incorrect data. Auctionator, a simpler version of auctioneer, record the price of all the goods in your bag whenever you do a full scan (only takes 10-30s), then it can be presented to you in a very simple, comprehensive way so you can see the trend of price yourself. There has been reports of a lot of ore farmers so the price will most likely be a lot cheaper than auctioneer predicted, but it is server dependent.

    3. Try selling vanilla rare enchant scrolls as they are normally very profitable. Take Crusader as an example: it is an area-specific drop recipe with a drop rate of 1-3% (I think), with EP leveling change not many people will concentrate on farming in there. Therefore it is a rare recipe to have, but the enchant itself is one of the top BoA weapon choices, so it sells. On my server the mats cost about 30-50g in total (4 Large Brilliant Shard, 2 Orbs) and it sells for 200-240g consistently, plus as far as I recall there are only about 3 of us who bothers to sell on the market. Low mat costs, high price and low deposit rate (1s for 48hr) means you cannot lose under whatever the circumstances. Therefore I recommend you avoid common enchant and turn to vanilla ones.

    4. Glyph competition is pretty heavy on my server too, but with tiny deposit rate the repost value for it is good. It is a nice market to tap into and the profit margin will be huge, but the downside is fierce competition because of the nature of inscription (the person doing the inscription is called a scribe in game).

    5. I am not an alchemist nor a maxed out JC so I'm sorry I cannot really answer your question.

    The above is just my thoughts, different people will advice you differently. It is only fair if you actually try these market yourself instead of following down a single path. If you did not know before the website The Undermine Journal (TUJ) is very useful for observing markets, competition behaviours etc. I personally believe you can only truely master them by means of trial and errors, of course taking people's advice into consideration will mean less trials and hopefully less errors. Hope this is helpful to you and good luck on earning some big money.

    Link to TUJ:http://theunderminejournal.com

  3. #3
    I'll look into the Crusader Enchant for sure. And I will download Auctionator.

    Like I said, I appreciate any feedback as I'm relatively new with the Auction House - everyone's experiences server to server I compare with my own.

    Thanks!

  4. #4
    Davison's Avatar
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    I'll answer your questions with how i'm dealing with gems, its one of the bigger markets i'm in with daily prospecting/cutting/auctioning,
    Keep in lind that things can depend on how much time your competitors have and market prices ofc.

    1: I'm posting 4 gems at a time of all cuts i can make, even if they are "unproffitable" ones, although i will stop posting certain inferno cuts below a certain point as all cuts of them tend to move quickly.
    every now and then (depends what i'm doing) i will check the AH this can vary from 30 mins to 2 hours, but not longer if possible, unless i'm at work.
    I will check if i'm undercut on any gems and cancel/repost anything.
    Tip: set your auction duration to 12 hrs to decrease gold loss, you will either need to cancel them or they will get sold within 12 hrs anyway.

    2: have no experience with herbs, but from an ore point of view i tend to buy anything within my price range, with only 2 sorts of ore you can easily know up to what price you can make a decent profit.
    This depends on your realm of course, if buying all profitable ore means you're buying 100's of stacks a day i wouldn't buy it all, but on my realm i think i'm buying an avg of 50-75 stacks of obsidium/elementium a day.
    Offcourse you need to have the time to shuffle/move it all.

    3: Check the prices for raw mats, in my experience undercutting on raw ah mats is even worse then on the gem market, but there should at least be some profitable scrolls.
    Check the sticky with the list of profitable enchants on the profession part of this forum and compare those to your server prices.
    I tend to keep crafting allot of necks/rings away from my "shuffle" lately as i'm ending up with to much mats in the end.

    4: There's definatly people on this forum who can give you a good answer to this, as i'm only halfway with my scribe, but as with most markets i can only advise you to do some research on your AH and see what sells, start small and expand to a wider range of glyphs as you move on.

    5: My alchemist is doing the living elements transmute everyday to get airs as these sell the highest on my realm, if prices drop and i can get some good deals on heavenly shard i tend to craft some scrolls of enchant weaopn -Hurricane (6 air, 6 shards)
    I also use it to transmute Carnelian to inferno rubies, as these move allot faster on the AH, if you're prospecting lots of ore you will have plenty of all the other gems.

    Something else i can suggest you is to check out the tradeskillmaster addons wich has its own sub-forum here, this is by far (personal opinion) the best addon i have ever used to play the AH, it takes some time to set up and get used to it, but i've been using it for a week now, and i wonder how i ever managed to sell anything on the AH without it.
    There's a very good guide there aswell on how to set it up.

    Thats all i can think of for now, might be some typos but its late and just finished prospecting 400 stacks of ore :-p
    Last edited by Davison; March 27th, 2011 at 09:20 PM. Reason: typos
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  5. #5
    Vince's Avatar
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    Contrary to what Vanditor said, it is definitely worth cancel/reposing gems, as long as you're only using the 12hr option. As you've no doubt noticed, competition in the JC market is fierce. Depending on how much competition there is, you can't really rely on people eating through your competitors wares to get to yours. Posting fees can certainly add up, but you'll more than make up for it in the volume of sales you'll make. Look in to using TSM with JC to make canceling and relisting gems a breeze. I've a guide on my site, if you're interested (http://bankofwukam.blogspot.com/2011...gold-with.html).

    Like Vanditor said, be careful when you use Auctioneer to buy ore. I'm not sure what you mean by "80%." Do you mean when it says the stacks are at 80% of the average value? What you should really be looking for is whether or not the ore is below the "floor" price, which is set by the value of the green gems you get if you cut and vendor them (54g for , 36g for ). And I think you could have too much ore, if you're buying more than you can move. Having a backlog of ore you bough for cheap is nice if prices spike, but you don't want to constantly be buying more than you can convert and sell.

    As for Cata scrolls, if people are selling them for really cheap (like, a fifth of their mat costs), buying them up to either relist for profit, or to hold on to is not a bad idea. I snatched stacks of cheap scrolls when people were dumping them for below 20g during the initial profession leveling rush, and I'm now able to sell them for upwards of 100g each. Selling the mats raw is definitely a good idea. If it's profitable to do so, you don't want to stockpile too much just in case prices start to crash. And definitely look in to selling Wrath and BC level enchants, as well as BoA and Twink enchants.

    I hate glyphs. I used to be in that market, and made a decent amount of gold right before and right after Cata launched, but it's just too much for me to keep up with any more. There are easily 5 or 6 other competitors that definitely cancel and relist multiple times a day, and I don't want to babysit those auctions to stay on top of the market, nor do I want to spend all that time milling herbs and crafting inks/glyphs. One day I might get back in to it and push my competitors out, but I'll definitely need a lot more free time than I have right now to handle that. Bottom line though, if you're willing to invest the time Glyphs can be great profit.

    Doing the Vol. Life -> Air on you alchys is great. Making or is a great way to get rid of excess red or orange gems, and is certainly worth it if you're short on these gems and it's cheaper to xmute than it is to buy them on the AH. Rarely if ever will xmuting the other rare gems be worth it.
    My Blog - Bank of Wukam

  6. #6
    I'm fairly new to this as well. Auctionator is pretty solid for me, i have a more intimate knowledge rather then just its listed as a green percentage but thats just my prefrence.
    12 hour option on gems and just 1-2 at a time. Take note of who is also posting and undercutting you, add to friends list and if they log off go to town. Before raids and after raids is usually prime time for me so make sure your lowest. Usually on the weekends i can pick up a bunch of gems that i dont have the cuts for at pretty much vendor prices(Green/yellows) and relist during the week for easy profits. Sometimes if there has been a bunch of undercutting i check the length of the remaining auctions and if their all long or less, post a couple at the max price for 24 hours. This more or less resets the market overnight and people dont just start posting at 39g since that was their last scan and the undercutting continues into oblivion(Same with scrolls)

    The rings/necks from shuffling are pretty profitable on their own, from my Mysales addon i know which ones i have a regular chance at selling and which ones i just dont even bother posting, tank rings/necks sell really consistantly and the green quality ones will too, just make sure its above DE cost.

    Cata scrolls their is probably 1/20th of the competition as there is for jc gems on my server so i jsut enjoy my 80-90g earthen vitality sales

  7. #7
    Base's Avatar
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    Some answers on how I deal with your issues:

    1. As some have mentioned, use 12h and cancel/repost every time you get near the AH. An addon like TSM is invaluable for this. When I am prospecting large amounts of ore I sit close to an AH and repost every 10 minutes maybe, my sales skyrocket. I try to time this with busy hours, like the friday evening when all the weekend players come on.

    2. Know the price, dont use %. I have a set price (3g per ore) below which I buy, at that price I know I can make gold. I stop buying when my stock gets unmanageable (10k+ ore I stop, even at low prices). If the bots move in I migth lower the floor at which I buy, by looking at the actual price you have a much better grasp of where the price is moving. There are days I cant find a single ore below 4g each, you dont want to be buying then even if auctioneer is telling you its at 80% of current market price.

    3. Pick the scrolls that do sell, TSM can help you decide which they are. Keep an eye on raw mats prices, some days prices spike, thats the time to unload. Again, get to knwo the value and how it moves, dont look at percentages. At weekends prices tent to go mad on a lot of items, find the pattern when to unload your excess stock.

    4. I am just getting into the glyph market (actually still leveling). My plan is to set a floor value on glyphs at which I get a profit (tip: make a seperate floor price per ink used). I will make 1 of each glyph above that value, and post them. I will recraft 1 at a time untill I know which glyphs move, and I will start posting more of those. Again, without TSM this would be a nightmare, so get that addon!

    5. My alchemyst is a transmute master. I make sure to do either the volatile or the truegold transmute every day. I also use him to make meta gems and inferno rubies, all those procs make me feel warm inside. Other blue gems are not worth it on my server. Next to that, look into primal might. Some days you can pick up the mats cheap (primals or the motes). They dont sell very fast but the profit margin is high, I buy mats for about 100g and sell for 500g, and they can proc on creation!

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by zee View Post
    I currently run Auctioneer as my main addon and I love it.
    (...)
    Also, the JC market on the server has maybe 4 of us that are constantly posting gems, so I find it competitive to keep up.

    1. I am undercut by a couple of copper within the hour or two I post a gem - I post three at a time now - should I continue to cancel and repost the gems as often as I am undercut? Is that even worth the deposit?
    2. I buy as much ore at 80% or lower of the price Autioneer tells me it's at. Can you never have enough cheap ore or herbs?
    3. The scrolls do not sell for the worth of the mats, should I simply stockpile or sell the mats raw?
    4. I have an Inscriptor(?)/Inscriptionist(?) but do not take advantage of the glyph market as there are so many glyphs that I find it hard to keep up. Should I attempt to tackle the glyph market again?
    5. Out of curiosity, as I have 3 (yes 3) nearly maxxed out alchemists, are there any transmutes I should be doing every day that are vital? I do the Volatile Life xmute every day at the moment. Are blue gems worth it?
    I would update my addon folder a bit, if I were you. I've compiled a list of the most used addons for goldmaking as of january / february 2011.

    1 & 4. I have retracted from these markets since I dont have time to constantly undercut. It all depends on the time you have available and the time you are willing to put into goldmaking.

    2. I buy Obsidium Ore when its at or below 45g a stack. The floor(please dont start a floor arguement in this thread aswell) is 53-54g, and that means you will break even by just cutting and vendoring the gems you get, so you cant loose gold when buying below the floor. How much ore you want is up to you. If you buy it below the floor, its an investement that cant go wrong. Again, its up to you how much gold you want to have left as liquid, and how much you want tied up invested in ore. Just keep in mind, prospecting takes time. Time is money.

    3. Scrolls VS mats, its some nice threads about it here, here, here and last but not least HERE.
    Every friday I post some statistics on what/how much I've sold the last week; MySales Weekly Statistics
    Are you prepared to supply those pets in 4.1.0? Check out my full list of sellable pets, and their rarity
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  9. #9
    Mugsley's Avatar
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    I personally find canceling auctions to be a waste of time for me. I would rather just list more gems. I rarely post anything for more than 12 hours anymore. I would rather react to prices than just throw items up and "hope" they sell. There are exceptions, such as Saronite Bars, where they will really only move if someone is leveling Blacksmithing.

    As others have said, for ore you want to look at your vendor floor instead of Auctioneer values. I've been burned by Auctioneer in the past by seeing those magical blue numbers and buying. Also, start to learn your per-item values and buy based on those numbers (Obsidium: any single ore below 2.8g is at least worth looking at, if not picking up; Elementium: same but 2.2g.)

    I'm sitting on a back stock of about 200 stacks of ore right now. Ore prices rebounded after the last bot banning wave (and 3 of the volume cheap ore posters have disappeared). I will process it over time, but I am already sitting on a giant back stock of raw gems (for me). I will continue to buy ore when I find it cheap, but I am past the point of buying out everything I can get my hands on. It's more about maintaining a level than achieving it, at this point.

    ---------------
    For what it's worth, I'm expecting a demand spike for gems across the board with 4.2, so it's not a bad idea to start socking up now. Alts will become much easier to gear up and there will be an entirely new tier of gear for main characters.

  10. #10
    ExtremeEagle's Avatar
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    1. In my opinion it is most definitely worth doing a cancel/repost when the market is like that. I will cut gems until I have 3 of every cut I know, then post them all for 12h. You can tell when the undercuts start coming in because I'll sell a ton during the first half-hour or hour, then it starts slowing down. I would say on average I sell between around 1.5k worth in the first couple hours, so if I do a cancel/restock/repost I get to repeat that. This more than makes up for the lost deposits. This all depends on your server and the day/time, of course. If you have a free Tuesday evening to sit down and babysit the AH you can probably cancel/repost every 30-45 minutes and keep up a steady stream of sales.

    2. When you have raw gems accumulating faster than you can cut and sell them, plus you're running out of storage space you may be running out of room. Usually when I start getting overloaded like this I will drop my buying price. If you can get it low enough, you may be able to buy larger amounts by prospecting then cutting and vendoring the uncommons while keeping the rares for stock.

    3. You may want to take a careful look at the price of some scrolls. On my server a good half of the scrolls are in the shape you describe where they are being sold extremely below cost, but there is another set that are bringing in good profit. Generally it seems the scrolls requiring essence offer the biggest returns. I'm selling the following at the moment:











    I also sell dust raw in addition to these, since I usually end up with more than enough. Auctionator is really good here. Instead of just undercutting the lowest, you want to pay close attention to stack sizes. There may be various stacks of 20 from 3g-5g, but the lowest price on singles could be 5g50s. In this case I'd undercut that price and sell in singles. Normally with stacks I won't even undercut the lowest(unless it's a wall.) If it's just one or two stacks I'll move up to the next highest prices and check those out, stopping once I find a larger amount like 5+ stacks and undercutting there. Feels good to throw up 10 stacks at 6g each when the AH lowest is ~3g and selling them all first time.

    4. There is definitely gold to be made in the glyph market, but it requires a large amount of time. I was inspired to dive back into it on my server after I started using TSM for my jewelcrafting. If I was going to advise someone starting out in glyphs, I would do this:
    - Download TSM, check out some of the guides on this site to become familiar with it, and set it up
    - Find out what an average price is that you can get large amounts of Cata herbs for, and figure out the cost per Blackfallow(I'm currently buying lower herbs at 50g/stack, Jasmine/Whiptail at 60g/stack.)
    - Go into TSM and manually set the price for every ink to your price for Blackfallow(10g in my example.)
    - Set a fairly high minimum threshold. This is one place I wish I had done different when I started. I figured that at 30g cost, I wanted to make every glyph worth 50g or more so I was getting at least 20g profit. Now I'm pushing around 500-600 auctions at once, having to make two trips between the AH and mailbox even with 4x inscription bags. Looking back, I probably would have set it to only craft glyphs where I could make 50g or more per sell. This will depend on your server also, and the other competitors you have. If the other sellers on your server have fallsbacks at 100g, you may have to look at lower profits. I sell glyphs at 200g fallback with some selling that high, so I would still have a good amount if I wanted to only those worth 100g+. (And the common term is "Scribe")

    5. For daily transmutes, the two main ones of interest are Truegold and Volatile Life -> Air(in Uldum.) You'll have to compare prices on your server to determine which is better. Usually Life->Air works out as steadier profit, while Truegold can feel more like playing the lottery when you hit a 5x proc. Depending on gem and herb prices, it's occasionally worth it for me to transmute Inferno Rubies, Demonseyes, and Ember Topaz depending on my stock.

 

 

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