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  1. #1
    Zippy's Avatar
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    Competitor "tanking the market" in glyphs.

    So I was listening to Just My Two Copper Blog weekly Q&A podcast, which is great btw if you have not heard of it.

    One of the participants talked about how he is heavy into glyphs. He said that he sometimes "tanks the market" on purpose for occasionally weeks at a time and deliberately takes a loss during that time, in order to flush out the competition. Then after that, he lets it come back up and makes that money back and then some.

    I have someone on my server doing this. Does anyone have any comments for someone who is trying to get into glyphs, who encounters someone doing this "tanking the market" thing? He is making it nearly impossible to make any real profits. Which is a smart play on his part, but not that great for me! I'm not losing any money so I don't plan on leaving. I don't undercut him when it will lead to a loss for me, but it does render that inventory temporarily unsellable. For the other gylphs, because of his activity, I'm making like 5g per, instead of like 30 or 40g per. Of course he is doing this on purpose to "scare" me away. However, I'm not going anywhere!

    Has anyone encountered this situation before? How do you suggest this person be dealt with?

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Kathroman's Avatar
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    How cheap are we talking?
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  3. #3
    That's the most advantagous part of being diversified. I would push other markets and lay low with glyphs for a day or three. Certainly replenish any low stocks from his cheap stuff if you can (I like to do anything I can to avoid crafting glyphs). His scaring people off will work to your advantage in the end.

  4. #4
    Kathroman's Avatar
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    I usually just continue on as I normally would. If the competition is too low, mine just post at fallback. What sometimes happens is, someone else (usually someone that has just installed auctioneer and is running their first "resale" scan ) will come along and reset the market for you. If they are Really cheap, then try buying a few yourself. If he throws more up, you obviously have a choice to make. I, personally, would keep buying them as glyphs are a pretty low-risk investment. Even if you get stuck buying 20 of them at 10g each, you only need to sell 4 of them at 50g (which would be a reasonable price for most glyphs) to make back that money.

    Right before Cataclysm started, I purchased a whole bunch of glyphs that were seemingly dumped by powerlevelers for less than 10g each. Probably like 60 - 70 total between 8 or 9 different glyphs. These were not your traditional "big sellers", but I have since sold every single one of them, all for well over 400% more. The glyph market is pretty stable, and it is a long-term market. It isn't really reasonable to try and keep someone out of it, so I would say you are right to stay.

    If his tactic is intended to scare you off, then up the anti: purchase all of his cheap glyphs. The end result is that you now have a fully stocked inventory of below cost glyphs, and he now has to spend the time and money to restock. That is likely a bigger loss than he thinks if you include all the time spent. He might be ok with lost profit, but the headache of buying all of those herbs, milling them and then crafting inks and then turning them into glyphs. That would drive me crazy. It will probably drive him crazy too.
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  5. #5
    I've never understood this tactic, what's supposed to stop you coming right back when prices return to a profitable level? If someone tried this on me they would get exactly zero days competition free to enjoy their market 'dominance' when prices started moving back up with the fantastic accomplishment of having ruined their own profits. I wouldn't even be thinking about it, TSM stops me posting when it's a waste of my time automatically, then posts again when it isn't.

  6. #6
    Zippy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathroman View Post
    How cheap are we talking?
    He will take glyphs that are going for like 50 to 60g and post like 6-10 of them for around 3g a pc. But he does it in such high volume that it would be very risky to buy him out. I don't feel comfortable accumulating that much inventory right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pennyworth View Post
    That's the most advantagous part of being diversified. I would push other markets and lay low with glyphs for a day or three. Certainly replenish any low stocks from his cheap stuff if you can (I like to do anything I can to avoid crafting glyphs). His scaring people off will work to your advantage in the end.
    I'm pretty diversified already. I'm into all aspects of JC, enchanting, tailoring, and blacksmithing, which are my main money makers and doing quite well with them. And Alchemy, whenever it is profitable, which is not that often. I'm already pushing the other markets pretty good. I'm looking to diversify even more by getting into glyphs but this guy is making it difficult to turn a profit. Which is exactly what I would do if I were in his shoes, because it smart to do to keep your market share, but I'm not. I have to level another alt still, in order to get into leather working and engineering. I would like to have all professions maxed and those are the two that I have left to do. So I plan to do that eventually.

    I'm trying to figure out a way to get some of this guy's market share without jumping in all the way in with loads and loads of inventory right off the bat. I'm trying to ease into it. I'm not sure if there is a good way to do that though.

  7. #7
    Kathroman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spoobob View Post
    I've never understood this tactic, what's supposed to stop you coming right back when prices return to a profitable level? If someone tried this on me they would get exactly zero days competition free to enjoy their market 'dominance' when prices started moving back up with the fantastic accomplishment of having ruined their own profits. I wouldn't even be thinking about it, TSM stops me posting when it's a waste of my time automatically, then posts again when it isn't.
    It's not so much a tactic as it is a pipe dream. I suppose the hope is that their sheer aggression/insanity will scare people off permanently. Instead of leaving and them coming back, just make them even crazier buy forcing them to have to go through ALL the trouble of keeping everything in stock. Seriously, look at some math:

    Assuming a stock of 3 x ~400 glyphs, restocking them would take 1 hour (3 sec cast time x 1200 glyphs). It would also require 3600 inks (3 per glyph) which would take 2 hours to make (2 sec cast time x 3600 inks). It would also take 12 minutes to mill all of the herbs (~ 5 ink per stack = 720 stacks of herbs, x 1 sec cast time). It will also take him approx 30 minutes to open all of that mail (1200 glyphs plus 720 stacks of herbs / approx 1 minute per batch). If you add all of the extra time he will spend running back and forth to get parchments/post his glyphs once his bags get full/dump stuff in the bank, etc. you are looking at approximately 4 HOURS for him to restock. Guess what you can be doing during those 4 hours? Reselling his glyphs for a profit!

    Hope that helps.
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  8. #8
    Kathroman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippy View Post
    I'm trying to figure out a way to get some of this guy's market share without jumping in all the way in with loads and loads of inventory right off the bat. I'm trying to ease into it. I'm not sure if there is a good way to do that though.
    If you can afford it, just buy 'em. 3g per glyph is an amazing price. Glyph costs on my server are approx 30g. If we are talking about again, ~400 glyphs, then even if he was posting 10 of each, that is only a 12 000g investment. I would bet you could make at least half of that back within a week. On the flip side, he would be taking a 108 000g loss. I'm quite sure he won't be "ok" with that for very long.

    By the way, if you do break him, make sure to let him know that his "tactic" will probably work on US - Zuluhed, since they are all just a bunch of noobs over there.

    3g glyphs FTW!
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  9. #9
    Z-Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippy View Post
    He will take glyphs that are going for like 50 to 60g and post like 6-10 of them for around 3g a pc. But he does it in such high volume that it would be very risky to buy him out. I don't feel comfortable accumulating that much inventory right now.
    We're not in Northrend anymore, we're not getting half of dozen glyphs from a 6g stack of herbs. Wipe him out. He can't replace them at that price, and he won't be playing much while he buys and mills another 2000 stacks of herbs. You could even turn them right back around and list them at 4-6g if you need your money back that badly (and your other competition inherits your problem). He's faced with the double whammy of losing 10,000 bottles of ink and having to deal with your wall when he comes back with more, and it will only take a few rounds of that before he runs out of ink and gold.

    I love the smell of bankruptcy in the morning.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Z-Man View Post
    ... He's faced with the double whammy of losing 10,000 bottles of ink and having to deal with your wall when he comes back with more, and it will only take a few rounds of that before he runs out of ink and gold.

    I love the smell of bankruptcy in the morning.
    This. Perfectly stated!

 

 

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